Rumble 13276 Dante vs. Doctor Doom

[corvette1710]

Magic would be affected by rending time and space, regardless of its origin, Echo. -.-

[AVP vs The Terminator]

Dante doesn't just slow down time, he stops it entirely. He also moves at hypersonic+ speeds and teleports regardless, he has class 100+ strength, and he has a healing factor that puts Wolverine's to shame when he's fighting at maximum capacity (seriously, I remember a scene in the third game when Dante was cut in half, and the wound healed as the sword passed through his body. It was like swinging a sword at Kitty Pryde). And yes, Yamato would absolutely wreck any barrier Doom could throw up. It'd just shear through the space the barrier was occupying.

 

And yes, Dante is completely invulnerable in his Majin Devil trigger form. He might not have a million ways to win this, but he only needs one. He speed-blitzes Doom and takes his head off.

[Guest force_echo]

Magic would be affected by rending time and space, regardless of its origin, Echo. -.-

No, it wouldn't. A weapon that rends space and time, would be stopped by something that basically defies the laws of nature. Magic in Marvel is low level reality warping. In fact, the two are considered equivalent with people like SS Strange and Scarlet Witch.

 

 

Dante doesn't just slow down time, he stops it entirely. He also moves at hypersonic+ speeds and teleports regardless, he has class 100+ strength, and he has a healing factor that puts Wolverine's to shame when he's fighting at maximum capacity (seriously, I remember a scene in the third game when Dante was cut in half, and the wound healed as the sword passed through his body. It was like swinging a sword at Kitty Pryde). And yes, Yamato would absolutely wreck any barrier Doom could throw up. It'd just shear through the space the barrier was occupying.

 

And yes, Dante is completely invulnerable in his Majin Devil trigger form. He might not have a million ways to win this, but he only needs one. He speed-blitzes Doom and takes his head off.

Oh no! He can stop time! That's definitely not something Doom can do at a whim either! Dr. Doom can teleport also, and doesn't need to move at hypersonic speed. The healing factor doesn't matter, Doom could dissociate his molecules, or teleport him to Hell where he can rot for eternity, tear his soul apart, trap him in a block of generated adamantium, turn him into chrome, use a neural disruptor, etc. etc. etc. Class 100 strength? Like that matters against Doom's shields?

 

He's invincible defined by what? The in-universe description, and not even that, since Jaeger just said that the Yamato could hurt him in the Devil Trigger form.

 

He speed-blitzes him, his sword gets deflected by Doom's magical barrier, and then he gets f*cked.

[Guest force_echo]

EDIT

[The Void]

By reading through everyone's post, I made up my mind and my final pick is Doom.

 

Dante is good and I like him, but Force made a REALLY good point about how powerful magic is in the Marvel universe.

[Indolent]

Yamato basically defies the laws of nature regardless and even if magic is low level reality warping, it'll still be cut through as was repeatedly stated - IT'S MEANT TO CUT THROUGH ANYTHING.

 

So that defense is still overwritten by that tiny fact .-.

 

As was mentioned, given the scenario and context, Doom is unprepared and unawares against an enraged Dante who's armed with the Yamato and has insane capabilities that pretty much ascertains Doom's impending death nigh immediately.

 

Were it any other scenario, where Doom was aware and prepared, Dante would lose certainly but here as given by the OP, Dante takes it.

[The Void]

I know?

 

Setup was funny.

[corvette1710]

No, it wouldn't. A weapon that rends space and time, would be stopped by something that basically defies the laws of nature.

 

If it resides in the physical plane as Doom's barriers invariably do, it will most definitely be rent by Yamato.

 

doesn't need to move at hypersonic speed.

 

In order to react to Dante's own speed (ie moving faster than he could possibly react, considering he's hypersonic from standstill), yes, he would need to move at hypersonic speeds, as with no planning or prep time for a being much too powerful for him to take on without, he'd get easily defeated, as he is going to here.

 

The healing factor doesn't matter, Doom could dissociate his molecules, or teleport him to Hell where he can rot for eternity, tear his soul apart, trap him in a block of generated adamantium, turn him into chrome, use a neural disruptor, etc. etc. etc.

 

The healing factor kind of does matter, seeing as Doom wouldn't simply dissociate his molecules, teleport him to hell, tear his soul apart, trap him in blocks of adamantium(which Yamato would cut), turn him to chrome, or use a neural disruptor against Dante, as he doesn't have the time (reaction time) to do anything once Dante kills Doom and takes back his soda.

 

Class 100 strength? Like that matters against Doom's shields?

 

When that strength swings a sword that easily rends Doom's shields, yes.

 

He's invincible defined by what? The in-universe description, and not even that, since Jaeger just said that the Yamato could hurt him in the Devil Trigger form.

 

I'm a bit surprised you don't know the definition of the world invincible... but his vulnerability to Yamato is very well explained, considering it TEARS THROUGH REALITY.

 

He speed-blitzes him, his sword gets deflected by Doom's magical barrier, and then he gets f*cked.

 

Just explained how that argument fails.

[The Void]

As was mentioned, given the scenario and context, Doom is unprepared and unawares against an enraged Dante who's armed with the Yamato and has insane capabilities that pretty much ascertains Doom's impending death nigh immediately.

 

Were it any other scenario, where Doom was aware and prepared, Dante would lose certainly but here as given by the OP, Dante takes it.

 

Just saying Doctor Doom is able to one shot people like Magus who are not only physically superior to Dante in every way, but have a variety of powers. Not only that but he is able to react to Adam speed blitzing.

 

 

He can do the same thing to Dante.

 

 

And Doom has defeated people like Surfer without prop.

[Indolent]

That image doesn't show speed blitzing at all?

 

And since when does Surfer not hold back considering he values life and doesn't have a sword that straight up face rapes reality, like you know how Dante does/is?

[The Void]

That image doesn't show speed blitzing at all?

 

And since when does Surfer not hold back considering he values life and doesn't have a sword that straight up face rapes reality, like you know how Dante does/is?

That image doesn't show speed blitzing at all?

 

And since when does Surfer not hold back considering he values life and doesn't have a sword that straight up face rapes reality, like you know how Dante does/is?

 

Right here...

 

 

Adam was trying to blitz him. During that encounter Doom was fighting Adam and Magus.

[Indolent]

All we see is him getting blasted by Doom - no signs of speed blitzing... >.>

[Guest force_echo]

No, it wouldn't. A weapon that rends space and time, would be stopped by something that basically defies the laws of nature.

 

If it resides in the physical plane as Doom's barriers invariably do, it will most definitely be rent by Yamato.

 

doesn't need to move at hypersonic speed.

 

In order to react to Dante's own speed (ie moving faster than he could possibly react, considering he's hypersonic from standstill), yes, he would need to move at hypersonic speeds, as with no planning or prep time for a being much too powerful for him to take on without, he'd get easily defeated, as he is going to here.

 

The healing factor doesn't matter, Doom could dissociate his molecules, or teleport him to Hell where he can rot for eternity, tear his soul apart, trap him in a block of generated adamantium, turn him into chrome, use a neural disruptor, etc. etc. etc.

 

The healing factor kind of does matter, seeing as Doom wouldn't simply dissociate his molecules, teleport him to hell, tear his soul apart, trap him in blocks of adamantium(which Yamato would cut), turn him to chrome, or use a neural disruptor against Dante, as he doesn't have the time (reaction time) to do anything once Dante kills Doom and takes back his soda.

 

Class 100 strength? Like that matters against Doom's shields?

 

When that strength swings a sword that easily rends Doom's shields, yes.

 

He's invincible defined by what? The in-universe description, and not even that, since Jaeger just said that the Yamato could hurt him in the Devil Trigger form.

 

I'm a bit surprised you don't know the definition of the world invincible... but his vulnerability to Yamato is very well explained, considering it TEARS THROUGH REALITY.

 

He speed-blitzes him, his sword gets deflected by Doom's magical barrier, and then he gets f*cked.

 

Just explained how that argument fails.

Actually, no you didn't. The shield does not "reside" in the physical plane because it is not a physical object, it is magical. It's laws aren't bound by anything at all, so it would be able to deflect Dante's reality warping sword just as it is able to deflect projectiles that literally warp reality, like Scarlet Witch's hex bolts, and Mephisto's magic powers. Next time you jump into a debate, make sure you at least look up what magic is.

 

As I said before, it doesn't matter if he can't react to the initial attack, because after that fails, Dante dies.

 

Actually, basic physics tell me that if he was encased in a solid object, even if he had a sword that could cut through said object he would not have the physical leverage to use said sword. But then again, you're not very good at reasoning. Except that Dante won't kill Doom in his initial attack, giving Doom enough time to retaliate and easily kill Dante.

 

If it was a sword that could rend through Doom's shields (which it isn't), then his strength still wouldn't matter you idiot. That's basic logic.

 

I'm a bit surprised YOU don't know the meaning of invincible. The definition of invincible is incapable of being harmed. If he is hurt by the sword, whether it bends reality or not, then he is not invincible. Plain and simple. Also, the meaning of the word invincible is universe specific. Plasma Dlex is stated to be invincible because there's nothing in that universe/multiverse that can break it, but it's never had to face Thor's blows.

 

Just explained how you're wrong. :) :)

[AVP vs The Terminator]

Oh dear, this devolved to insults quickly. I'm out.

[The Void]

All we see is him getting blasted by Doom - no signs of speed blitzing... >.>

 

To me it looked like Doom reacted to a blitz.

 

Anyways heres a better one.

 

 

 

One should note that the Human Torch can achieve a normal flight speed of 140 miles per hour, and accelerate up to supersonic speeds capable of catching up with faster beings such as the Silver Surfer while in the Earth's orbit.

[AVP vs The Terminator]

That's ridiculous, Adam Warlock or Magus should easily own Doom. >.>

[The Void]

That's ridiculous, Adam Warlock or Magus should easily own Doom. >.>

That's ridiculous, Adam Warlock or Magus should easily own Doom. >.>

 

He had help.

[AVP vs The Terminator]

Ah, that makes sense then.

[Guest force_echo]

He had help from Kang, but Kang didn't do much during the fight. As you can see, Dr. Doom took out Adam by himself, and then proceeds to take out Kang and Magus. It should be noted that Magus had the Infinity Gauntlet.

[Indolent]

Um. Dante is Hypersonic which > Supersonic by far. Not to mention time stop.

 

And that previous scan that seems to be blitzing to you in no way is blitzing - so I'm sensing a bit of bias there - either that or you can't clearly see as it's just him getting blasted by Doom - nothing indicates actual movement.

 

And the Silver Surfer travels at low speed such as that within atmosphere which is why the Human Torch can keep up with him... so it doesn't really show much... also I could submit that The Sentry has *fake word*ed Dr. Doom relatively easily within atmosphere and iirc, speedsters typically maintain low speeds within the atmosphere as to not damage the planet.

[The Void]

Um. Dante is Hypersonic which > Supersonic by far.

 

Source? And I clearly said Human torch can go faster.

 

And that previous scan that seems to be blitzing to you in no way is blitzing - so I'm sensing a bit of bias there - either that or you can't clearly see as it's just him getting blasted by Doom - nothing indicates actual movement.

 

No one is being bias. To me it looked like Adam was moving toward Doom but Doom stopped him in his tracks by blasting him.

 

And the Silver Surfer travels at low speed such as that within atmosphere which is why the Human Torch can keep up with him... so it doesn't really show much... also I could submit that The Sentry has *fake word*ed Dr. Doom relatively easily within atmosphere and iirc, speedsters typically maintain low speeds within the atmosphere as to not damage the planet.

 

Uh...Sentry can travel to the sun in less than five minutes, so no doubt he can easily speed blitz Doom. I don't understand your point, Sentry is 10x faster than Dante.

[Guest sirmethos]

1. None of the scans posted, shows any kind of impressive speed by Doom. Neither combat/movement speed, nor reaction speed.

 

The first scans, don't give any indication that Magus and/or Adam is actually using their superior speed. To put it in simple terms, while they are capable of moving at superhuman speeds, there is no indication that they are actually using that speed.

 

In the scan with Human Torch, there is, again, no indication of extreme speed. Not to mention the fact that Doom is warned by the kid shouting at Johnny.

 

To summarize, there is no evidence to show that Doom would actually be able to hit Dante, if the latter is moving at top speeds.

 

 

2. No actual evidence has been provided, to support the claim that Yamato would be able to penetrate Doom's magical shields. Especially considering some of the things/attacks that those shields have easily withstood.

 

 

All Doom needs, is a split second in which he can use the Ovoid Mind Transfer. Something neither side of the debate seems to have considered.

[comic_book_fan]

1. None of the scans posted, shows any kind of impressive speed by Doom. Neither combat/movement speed, nor reaction speed.

 

The first scans, don't give any indication that Magus and/or Adam is actually using their superior speed. To put it in simple terms, while they are capable of moving at superhuman speeds, there is no indication that they are actually using that speed.

 

In the scan with Human Torch, there is, again, no indication of extreme speed. Not to mention the fact that Doom is warned by the kid shouting at Johnny.

 

To summarize, there is no evidence to show that Doom would actually be able to hit Dante, if the latter is moving at top speeds.

 

 

2. No actual evidence has been provided, to support the claim that Yamato would be able to penetrate Doom's magical shields. Especially considering some of the things/attacks that those shields have easily withstood.

 

 

All Doom needs, is a split second in which he can use the Ovoid Mind Transfer. Something neither side of the debate seems to have considered.

oh i considered it just never mentioned it because thats always the first thing i go to in Doom debates and wanted to try something diffrent.

[corvette1710]

Actually, no you didn't. The shield does not "reside" in the physical plane because it is not a physical object, it is magical. It's laws aren't bound by anything at all, so it would be able to deflect Dante's reality warping sword just as it is able to deflect projectiles that literally warp reality, like Scarlet Witch's hex bolts, and Mephisto's magic powers. Next time you jump into a debate, make sure you at least look up what magic is.

 

Actually it is a physical object, it occupies the physical plane (which Yamato cuts through at Dante's whim).

 

As I said before, it doesn't matter if he can't react to the initial attack, because after that fails, Dante dies.

 

Except he wouldn't survive the initial attack. Which is what I've been explaining to you, but you refuse to believe because it's evident you don't understand the meaning of RENDS TIME AND SPACE.

 

 

 

Actually, basic physics tell me that if he was encased in a solid object, even if he had a sword that could cut through said object he would not have the physical leverage to use said sword. But then again, you're not very good at reasoning. Except that Dante won't kill Doom in his initial attack, giving Doom enough time to retaliate and easily kill Dante.

 

Then I misinterpreted. I had supposed you meant in a cube or sphere or something similar.

 

 

 

If it was a sword that could rend through Doom's shields (which it isn't), then his strength still wouldn't matter you idiot. That's basic logic.

 

Uh, actually, it kind of does. The more strength I can muster, the harder I can swing it. That is basic logic. Though since Yamato can and will rend the shields like paper, I suppose you're right... though with aforementioned phrase concerning strength, he can swing it faster, too.

 

 

 

I'm a bit surprised YOU don't know the meaning of invincible. The definition of invincible is incapable of being harmed. If he is hurt by the sword, whether it bends reality or not, then he is not invincible. Plain and simple. Also, the meaning of the word invincible is universe specific. Plasma Dlex is stated to be invincible because there's nothing in that universe/multiverse that can break it, but it's never had to face Thor's blows.

 

Not necessarily. While I made the mistake of using invincible, it isn't universe-specific if it's stated (whether in-game, or by developers, or whatever).

 

Just explained how you're wrong. :) :)

 

Rebuked.

 

EDIT: To add on to my explanation of something not being universe-specific, that's like saying adamantium can't be damaged except by molecular dismemberment(or cutting on a molecular level or what have you) and then asking for proof. >.>

[The Void]

1. None of the scans posted, shows any kind of impressive speed by Doom. Neither combat/movement speed, nor reaction speed.

 

The first scans, don't give any indication that Magus and/or Adam is actually using their superior speed. To put it in simple terms, while they are capable of moving at superhuman speeds, there is no indication that they are actually using that speed.

 

In the scan with Human Torch, there is, again, no indication of extreme speed. Not to mention the fact that Doom is warned by the kid shouting at Johnny.

 

To summarize, there is no evidence to show that Doom would actually be able to hit Dante, if the latter is moving at top speeds.

 

 

2. No actual evidence has been provided, to support the claim that Yamato would be able to penetrate Doom's magical shields. Especially considering some of the things/attacks that those shields have easily withstood.

 

 

All Doom needs, is a split second in which he can use the Ovoid Mind Transfer. Something neither side of the debate seems to have considered.

 

In the scan with HT its obvious that the HT was going for a speed blitz. And Doom has fought people much faster than Dante.

 

But anyways you're right about the Ovoid Mind Transfer.