Rumble 13276 Dante vs. Doctor Doom

[AVP vs The Terminator]

Just read through the Infinity War, looks like both Adam and Magus had been depowered. Magus had stripped Warlock of the Soul Gem, and the Living Tribunal was preventing the gauntlet from working correctly, so... It's not really a speed feat.

 

And I don't think Doom would use the mind transfer so casually, which is why I didn't bring it up. It seems more like a last resort type of thing.

[Guest sirmethos]

"Actually it is a physical object, it occupies the physical plane (which Yamato cuts through at Dante's whim)."

 

No, it's not a physical object, it's pure magical energy.

 

And the fact that it is magical energy, means that it doesn't necessarily occupy the physical plane. The very core of magic, is that it doesn't play by the rules of science.

 

 

"Except he wouldn't survive the initial attack. Which is what I've been explaining to you, but you refuse to believe because it's evident you don't understand the meaning of RENDS TIME AND SPACE."

 

You have given absolutely no evidence to support your claim, that Doom would not survive the initial attack, i.e. that Yamato can actually cut through Doom's magical barrier.

 

And you don't seem to understand the meaning of "magic".

 

 

"Uh, actually, it kind of does. The more strength I can muster, the harder I can swing it. That is basic logic. Though since Yamato can and will rend the shields like paper, I suppose you're right... though with aforementioned phrase concerning strength, he can swing it faster, too."

 

No, it really doesn't. If we were talking about a physical defense, then you would be right, since a harder, more dense, physical object, requires more strength/more kinetic energy for the sword to slice through it. But since the shield is pure (magical)energy, it's purely a matter of whether the sword can actually cut through it or not. If the sword can cut through the shield, then the strength behind the swing is a non-issue. And if the sword can not cut through the shield, then no amount of strength will help it.

 

You're right about the speed though, more strength = faster swing speed.

 

 

"Not necessarily. While I made the mistake of using invincible, it isn't universe-specific if it's stated (whether in-game, or by developers, or whatever)."

 

Whether the term "invincible", in regards to the Devil Trigger, is universe-specific or not, is irrelevant. Since the fact that Yamato can cut through it, shows quite clearly that it is not invincible, merely "highly durable".

 

 

"To add on to my explanation of something not being universe-specific, that's like saying adamantium can't be damaged except by molecular dismemberment(or cutting on a molecular level or what have you) and then asking for proof. >.>"

 

Proof which would be easy to give. If Adamantium can be damaged by things other than molecular dismemberment, etc. then there would be proof of that.

 

With the "invincibility" of the Devil Trigger, there is proof that it is not invincible, by the fact that Yamato can cut through it.

 

 

"In the scan with HT its obvious that the HT was going for a speed blitz."

 

It is also obvious that Doom was warned, before Johnny even started his attack. Which means, that he was already bracing himself. Not a speed feat.

 

 

"And Doom has fought people much faster than Dante."

 

And no one is contesting that. What is being contested, is that Doom would be able to react to Dante's speed. Something that the people arguing for Doom, has not provided any evidence to support.

 

 

"And I don't think Doom would use the mind transfer so casually, which is why I didn't bring it up. It seems more like a last resort type of thing."

 

If Dante is moving too fast for Doom to get a hit in otherwise, it would be a "last resort".

[AVP vs The Terminator]

True. Though the desperation Devil Trigger Tom mentioned earlier is actually a more powerful version of the regular DT, and Yamato hasn't been tested against it to my knowledge. To everything else in the game, however, it's completely invincible.

[Guest force_echo]

Actually, no you didn't. The shield does not "reside" in the physical plane because it is not a physical object, it is magical. It's laws aren't bound by anything at all, so it would be able to deflect Dante's reality warping sword just as it is able to deflect projectiles that literally warp reality, like Scarlet Witch's hex bolts, and Mephisto's magic powers. Next time you jump into a debate, make sure you at least look up what magic is.

 

Actually it is a physical object, it occupies the physical plane (which Yamato cuts through at Dante's whim).

 

As I said before, it doesn't matter if he can't react to the initial attack, because after that fails, Dante dies.

 

Except he wouldn't survive the initial attack. Which is what I've been explaining to you, but you refuse to believe because it's evident you don't understand the meaning of RENDS TIME AND SPACE.

 

 

 

Actually, basic physics tell me that if he was encased in a solid object, even if he had a sword that could cut through said object he would not have the physical leverage to use said sword. But then again, you're not very good at reasoning. Except that Dante won't kill Doom in his initial attack, giving Doom enough time to retaliate and easily kill Dante.

 

Then I misinterpreted. I had supposed you meant in a cube or sphere or something similar.

 

 

 

If it was a sword that could rend through Doom's shields (which it isn't), then his strength still wouldn't matter you idiot. That's basic logic.

 

Uh, actually, it kind of does. The more strength I can muster, the harder I can swing it. That is basic logic. Though since Yamato can and will rend the shields like paper, I suppose you're right... though with aforementioned phrase concerning strength, he can swing it faster, too.

 

 

 

I'm a bit surprised YOU don't know the meaning of invincible. The definition of invincible is incapable of being harmed. If he is hurt by the sword, whether it bends reality or not, then he is not invincible. Plain and simple. Also, the meaning of the word invincible is universe specific. Plasma Dlex is stated to be invincible because there's nothing in that universe/multiverse that can break it, but it's never had to face Thor's blows.

 

Not necessarily. While I made the mistake of using invincible, it isn't universe-specific if it's stated (whether in-game, or by developers, or whatever).

 

Just explained how you're wrong.

 

Rebuked.

 

EDIT: To add on to my explanation of something not being universe-specific, that's like saying adamantium can't be damaged except by molecular dismemberment(or cutting on a molecular level or what have you) and then asking for proof. >.>

I'm sorry, but saying that a magical barrier is physical is simply plain out wrong, there's no other way to put it. It baffles me that someone could even seriously make that claim. Newsflash, there's a difference between a magical shield and one made out of rock. Not only is it not physical, but it doesn't even abide by conventional laws of time and space. Again, these shields can withstand localized warps in reality, Dante's sword will be no different.

 

I feel like I'm repeating myself at this point.

 

If Doom can't react to Dante's speed anyway, then it matters not how fast he swings the sword, since according to you people, Doom can't react anyway.

 

The point is, it's apparently not invincible, nor is it infinite. Also, the developers have nothing to do with whether something is universe specific because they don't deal with anything outside their own universe. A Predator writer is not going to say, "Plasma Dlex is invincible to anything in Predators, but Thor and Superman could break it", that makes no sense whatsoever.

 

Lol, might wanna learn what rebuked means too, while you're at it.

[Guest force_echo]

Also, a lot of Doom's attacks are area attacks, so it won't matter how fast Dante is moving. He has a magical attack that can easily transmute people, and since it's homing. Other magical attacks are area effect. Or he could just fire his ray guns in an arc and take out everything in front of them, since they're designed to fight cosmic level beings, they'll probably dissociate Dante's molecular structure.

[Callisto]

Match Final Results

Dante: 7

Doctor Doom: 5

 

[Guest Dinsdale Piranha]

I'm late to the party but here's a better scan of Doom reacting to a blitz. Please excuse the Italian dub and the mediocre Don Heck art.

 

[Guest Dinsdale Piranha]

That's Quicksilver in the green, just in case he's hard to recognize. The art doesn't do justice to him but the stylized blurring in panel 2 suggests an attack at invisible or near-invisible speeds.

[Guest force_echo]

Quicksilver in those days was barely supersonic if I recall correctly, but still a good scan.

[Guest Dinsdale Piranha]

Yeah, I think you're right about his speed level.